I was just saying last night to my friend that I thought it was ridiculous that people earning £100k could still claim CB & also that city fat cats with huge private pensions could still get state pensions, while other 80 yr olds were freezing to death on low payments . I thought they should become means tested (but quite generous cut off points eg £100k).

Anyway, George was clearly listening to me last night & has announced if you or your partner earn £44k you will not be entitled to CB anymore. In theory I agree with this BUT the major flaw is....

As they dont want it to be means tested and have complicated forms and assessments the only question that matters is if you earn over 44k... Now that means that if you earn £39k and your OH £41k you will have a household income of £80k but still be entitled as there isnt an earner over £44k???????? CRAZY!!!!

Does anyone agree with new system/ hate it completly?

I saw this earlier on the news too.

I agree with you, it does sound a bit strange, and you would think it would be done on household income.

I try not to get into politics debates, as I dont know enough about them to put in my two pennies worth, but I do believe that Labour will be back in at the next election anyway x

Well I am really fed up about this, i have never received any benefits of any kind and have paid £1000's of tax over the years. I dont see why i should not get this just because i have worked hard to get a good job. I have to say it does annoy me when people say 'why should high earners get it'. My question would be why SHOULDN'T they get it given that it is their taxes that contribute towards paying it for everyone.

End of rant

Im pissed too! This is the only thing guaranteed, we pay taxes and a lot of them too

We lost £10k at the start of this year so we would be under that for Dans earnings this year anyway - but by the time it comes in then we wont get a penny

They are happy to take our tax but oh no cant get anything back

I am mad today anyway - I cant afford not to work and go to college instead because apparently we earn too much - even dropping my salary we still don't get any benefits other than the child one - yet if I wasn't working I'd get my bills paid, be able to study and get some money from the government - it drives me mad that we have less choice than those who don't work!

it is so annoying, i assumed we'd get help with childcare when i went back to work but even dropping my hours right down we get nothing, its not like we're high earners either.

The way they have done it means that its single parents who have worked hard & are earning a good wage that will be affected, and also stay at home mums who's OH is working hard lose out. Meanwhile people that both work at good jobs will still get it when they may have nearly double the income. I dont think thats fair at all. Does someone with a household income of £75k need £1k of CB????

I agree that its somewhat unfair that people who work hard dont get any benefit but if there is only a certain amount of money in the pot is it not better that it goes to those that genuinely need it (and I dont mean the cheats etc) than people who dont? Eg give the pensionner that cant afford to heat their house adequately in the winter an extra £30 a week rather than give the pensionner with a company pension of £40K a state pension to invest in shares/put in savings?
Or give the woman who is working as a home help an extra £20 a week in CB rather than continue giving it to the wife of a city banker who spends it on her nails each week?

They are extreme examples. I dont advocate taking tax credits off middle earners , and I admit there are some scroungers out there... but if theres only a certain amount to go round I dont think its right that people who do have more than enough to live comfortably should expect people that are really struggling to have less to allow them to get something they feel morally entitled to... Not everybody is capable of earning a decent wage. Alot of people are only qualified for £10-15k a year jobs, and dont have the brain power to improve their prospects, they arent lazy, just unlucky that they arent clever.

And now im sitting back waiting the backlash

snoopy21 wrote:

The way they have done it means that its single parents who have worked hard & are earning a good wage that will be affected, and also stay at home mums who's OH is working hard lose out. Meanwhile people that both work at good jobs will still get it when they may have nearly double the income. I dont think thats fair at all. Does someone with a household income of £75k need £1k of CB????

I agree that its somewhat unfair that people who work hard dont get any benefit but if there is only a certain amount of money in the pot is it not better that it goes to those that genuinely need it (and I dont mean the cheats etc) than people who dont? Eg give the pensionner that cant afford to heat their house adequately in the winter an extra £30 a week rather than give the pensionner with a company pension of £40K a state pension to invest in shares/put in savings?
Or give the woman who is working as a home help an extra £20 a week in CB rather than continue giving it to the wife of a city banker who spends it on her nails each week?

They are extreme examples. I dont advocate taking tax credits off middle earners , and I admit there are some scroungers out there... but if theres only a certain amount to go round I dont think its right that people who do have more than enough to live comfortably should expect people that are really struggling to have less to allow them to get something they feel morally entitled to... Not everybody is capable of earning a decent wage. Alot of people are only qualified for £10-15k a year jobs, and dont have the brain power to improve their prospects, they arent lazy, just unlucky that they arent clever.

And now im sitting back waiting the backlash

I can not believe they think this is the right way to do it - it should be joint, its completely unfair otherwise!

As for the other bit, I agree to a point - but when those that PAY the taxes are left with less choices becuase they have to work thats when its wrong - whether anything can be done about that isnt the point, its just wrong!

If the government have there way there will be no benefits whatsoever to help families.

Not good!

x

I agree the way they have done it is really stupid!

The only thing i would say about taking it off people who work is that it costs money to work! For example if LIly went to nursery full time so i could continue to work it would cost me well over £600 per month but this is not taken into consideration.

I deffo dont have a problem with those who need help getting it but it narks me that i am wearing myself out to earn money and get nothing whereas some people seem to be able to sit on their bum and get loads for doing nothing (this is not aimed at anyone here by the way!!)

How did I know Lisa would be the first to respond

I am coming round to being more accepting of the arguements for people earning what I deemed to be a pretty good wage getting state help. It was only through a wine provoked debate with my friend that I realised how difficult it can be. She earns £20-£25k as does her OH. I used to think she was bloody loaded and had a cheek on her to moan about financial stress to me who is on IS and OH earning £4k in tesco and getting (genuinely, I promise!!) DLA.

But when she went through their earnings after tax, the fact that she has to pay £450 a month in nursery fees, gets v.little tax credits, has a mortgage of £750 a month, pays £100's for petrol to get to her job etc I realised that at the end of the month she doesnt have much money once bills are paid. In fact we are pretty equal. Well apart from the fact I rent and have to move every year and she owns a 4 bed lush house and the fact I drive an 8yr old 106 and she drives a 3yr old huge shiney jeep! Oh and she holidays every year and I have been once in the last 10 years...

Essentially that is what she is working and stressing for, a jeep and a picture perfect house. She admits herself that she is too far in, she has to work. The mortgage, loans and cc bills need paid.

The nasty/jealous part of me wants to say that its the lifestyle she wants so she should pay for it herself and get on with it. If it really is so much easier being me then why dont they quit their jobs and live on benefits? But then I suppose thats the arguement about not having a choice anymore. The mortgage is hanging over them....

We have been through our finances and we just cant see how it will benefit us by me going back to work after we have had this baby.

We will end up spending more if I worked than we would if I didnt go back and it just doesnt make much sense for us to do it.

By the time we have taken into account car usage, petrol, childcare to cover the extra Aimee would be in nursery (she doesnt go yet, but will be), it just doesnt work out worth it.

On top of that, it would take us over the threshold they have set for the new tax credits too, meaning that I would be working 5 mornings a week to clear about £200 a month, which to me, isnt worth being away from my kids for.

I will still be earning a little from home by working for my brothers company, but to go back to my current job for 3 hours a day just doesnt work out financially viable.

yes mortgages are bloody scary! We don't have one as its parents house, and when we lost that £10k we weren't able to pay rent for 2 months - not sure how that would have worked with a mortgage?!

If we had a mortgage there is no way I could have considered leaving the job I did last month - but even if I get average pay job we will be ok

That is a really stupid way of working it out.....would a combined income amount not have made more sense???

xx

Pepper wrote:

That is a really stupid way of working it out.....would a combined income amount not have made more sense???

xx

Yup. Its ridiculously stupid!!! Its the rich getting richer! (By £1k ) Labour wouldnt have done this (Please dont start replying with all labours double standard policies!!!, this would end up getting sent to debates and polls )

teheehhehehe you starting Snoopy?! Outside. right now!

Im a good girl!!!

Iv a habit of starting things accidentally and leaving my laptop for a few hrs and finding WW3 has started, been locked and trashed by the time I get back. Think the last time it was about a happy meal ffs

I agree it should be joint household income but also disagree with middle/ higher earners not being entitled. Ive already lost my tax credits (well for some reason they have paid me last 2 months but am querying em) and on a joint household of 44k would also lose on CB (just) yet my rent is 600, not a mortgage -rent on a 2 bed house and thats standard for my area so im not stressing ab out keeping a perfect house just trying to rent somewhere where id have a room for my kids to sleep. We holiday in the UK and drive a 51 plate nissan im still paying my mum for who paid 2 grand for it. A good sized chunk of my money goes on paying off debts oh and i have accrued. And i dont doubt they are our fault but we are working our socks off to clear them as fast as possible. So my cb pays my childminding fees one morning a week just so i can actually get some sleep after my nights and the rest of the time i have to farm c out to my family for a few hours to get some shut eye. I could forgo my childminder but id find myself awake for 48 hours at a time. In 3 years when we have cleared what we owe id be happy for forgo my cb and cut my hours but for now im stuck in a loop, it might be one of my own making but it doesnt change things (and to be fair only part of it is of my making 6k of it was a loan i had to take out when i qualified and the nhs decided not to pay me for 3 months even though id moved out by then and still had bills coming in and 4k of it was my wedding (and 4k is hardly an excessive amount for a wedding))

Oooooh happy meals theres a minefield

Mario, you wouldnt lose your CB as it is a joint household income of £44, not one person earning that amount.

x

marioandthestuntbubs wrote:

I agree it should be joint household income but also disagree with middle/ higher earners not being entitled. Ive already lost my tax credits (well for some reason they have paid me last 2 months but am querying em) and on a joint household of 44k would also lose on CB (just) yet my rent is 600, not a mortgage -rent on a 2 bed house and thats standard for my area so im not stressing ab out keeping a perfect house just trying to rent somewhere where id have a room for my kids to sleep. We holiday in the UK and drive a 51 plate nissan im still paying my mum for who paid 2 grand for it. A good sized chunk of my money goes on paying off debts oh and i have accrued. And i dont doubt they are our fault but we are working our socks off to clear them as fast as possible. So my cb pays my childminding fees one morning a week just so i can actually get some sleep after my nights and the rest of the time i have to farm c out to my family for a few hours to get some shut eye. I could forgo my childminder but id find myself awake for 48 hours at a time. In 3 years when we have cleared what we owe id be happy for forgo my cb and cut my hours but for now im stuck in a loop, it might be one of my own making but it doesnt change things (and to be fair only part of it is of my making 6k of it was a loan i had to take out when i qualified and the nhs decided not to pay me for 3 months even though id moved out by then and still had bills coming in and 4k of it was my wedding (and 4k is hardly an excessive amount for a wedding))

they didnt pay the usual £40 last month hmmmmmmmmmmmm I should ring em!

Laura wrote:

Mario, you wouldnt lose your CB as it is a joint household income of £44, not one person earning that amount.

x

No I know i wont lose it im simply saying that if they did do it on joint income it would actually be the middle earners affected rather than the high earners. Im in the middle earning bracket. I think if its going on 1 person earning 44k its gonna actually make little difference to the economy tbh

marioandthestuntbubs wrote:

Laura wrote:

Mario, you wouldnt lose your CB as it is a joint household income of £44, not one person earning that amount.

x

No I know i wont lose it im simply saying that if they did do it on joint income it would actually be the middle earners affected rather than the high earners. Im in the middle earning bracket. I think if its going on 1 person earning 44k its gonna actually make little difference to the economy tbh

It will save the economy 1bn a year by scraping it for those earning over £44k. I was shocked it was so much.

marioandthestuntbubs wrote:

Laura wrote:

Mario, you wouldnt lose your CB as it is a joint household income of £44, not one person earning that amount.

x

No I know i wont lose it im simply saying that if they did do it on joint income it would actually be the middle earners affected rather than the high earners. Im in the middle earning bracket. I think if its going on 1 person earning 44k its gonna actually make little difference to the economy tbh

Ahhh got what you mean. Hopefully it wont happen

x

I think the way they're going about it is all wrong but I think the whole benfit system is wrong anyway... sorry I know this is going to upset a lot of people but here goes

I've never lived in the UK so have never been living somewhere where there are so many benefits PLUS free health care.

I have to pay for everything, I have to work, I even have to pay for Tylers vaccinations, I paid to give birth to him etc etc.

So the fact that people get benefits "just because" really irritates me. the people that really do need help are the ones that are suffering because of the way the system is.

No offence but if you have never lived here its hardly a balanced opinion. I dont get benefits 'just because'. I pay a whack of tax AND national insurance to contribute to the economy that these benefits come out of. So im hardly just taking a hand out as i put way more in than i get out thank you very much